Sankofa Ra

ROBERT LUCKETT: My name is Robby Luckett. Today is Saturday, March 18, 2017. We’re at the Smith Robertson Museum and Cultural Center in Jackson, Mississippi. Do I have your permission to record this interview?

SANKOFA RA: Yes, you do.

RL: Can you tell me your name and spell it, please?

SR: My name is Sankofa Ra; S as in Sam, A as in Adam, N as in Nancy, K as in Kite, O as in ostrich, F as in Frank, A as in Adam. My last name is Ra; R-A.

RL: Tell me a little bit about yourself, where you’re from, how you grew up, about your parents, and a little bit of your background.

SR: I was born to a woman of African ancestry out of the South, from Georgia. Her name is Sabrina Fairchild Robinson [sp?]. My father, out of African ancestry from Saint Lucia in the Caribbean, his name is Mercier Joseph Bob [sp?]. And I was born in the Bronx, in a fierce, 00:01:00cold, winter blizzard on December 8, 1976. And, yeah, so I was raised in the Bronx for about two years, and over time I was taken over and raised by my grandmother, Marie Robinson [sp?], and my great-grandmother, Emma May Wright [sp?], my mother’s side. And, you know, even though I have 12 siblings, six brothers and six sisters, I was ironically raised as a separate child. So I grew up pretty much around elders. Even though it was in New York, I grew up with elders who were, you know, from the South. And so, you know, 00:02:00in the building, it was all filled up with people from the South, so you felt like—you know, it was like its own little community within itself because the Southern hospitality was very there, very strong, and everybody went and checked on each other and made sure no one went hungry.

My great-grandmother, she was very much the matriarch of the family. She always made sure that everyone was taken care of. If someone needed help, no matter where the family was, whether—you know, ’cause I have a very big family, they’re spread out—whether they were in Detroit, New York, the South, she would make sure that if they needed help, she would go out and help them, because that’s what you did, you know. Your family comes first. And so I learned that from her. I learned how to, you know, be nurturing and loving, and to take care of others, and to see it as a selfless act. That was just part of what you do, that you look after your family. You look after others.

And I learned from my grandmother 00:03:00the importance of being yourself and whatever your station was in life, socially or economically, that the way you presented yourself in the world was what really mattered. And that was a really important piece, ’cause she taught me the beauty of books. She had great plethora of books, I mean, whether it was yoga or if it was Elijah Muhammad or if it was anything, anything you could possibly think of, she had a book about it. And, amazingly, I learned yoga from her, you know, by watching her. So she was quite an amazing woman.

She strutted her stuff because back then, no matter, whether you was cleaning houses, you always what they call dress to the nines. So she was always dressed to impress, and you would never know that most of her life she always was cleaning houses and doing domestic work. But she’d always say that, you know, it’s the way you present yourself. You gotta take care of yourself. And 00:04:00it doesn’t matter what people think of you or what you’re doin’, but it matters what you think of yourself and how you present yourself to the world. So that was what really stood with me.

So I, you know, was raised in New York, went to school in New York. My first love was actually archeology, ’cause I always loved history and wanted to know what is the source of things. You know, where does that come from? What is the meaning of that? But I went to school, went to Marist College in New York. I stayed close to my family, and plus ’cause my grandmother was—she had her and her job, and so I wanted to stay closer and, you know, keep an eye on her, and also do my studies. So my mother was like, “Well, you be practical. Do something that makes sense,” so— And I went to school for business, studied business. I mean, I love organization and business sense. But, for me, I felt like I had to—I needed more 00:05:00than that. And so I was in search of myself, trying to figure things out.

But one day, a very dear friend of mine, she just looked at me, and she was like, “You know what? You would be an amazing midwife.” And I said, “Oh, wow, really?” I said, “That’s amazing,” ’cause I’ve always had great respect for Black midwives. And, I mean, even though it wasn’t something that was taught to me, or sometimes really talked about, because my grandmother and my great-grandmother, they were all, you know, ushered into the world by midwives, ’cause that was common in the South. I mean, especially if you lived in what they call the backwoods, you know, you was birthed by a midwife.

But yeah, so it’s just been— I find that if something is your calling, it just finds you. And so when I started getting into births and—what do they say—catching babies and being there with women, it just felt so natural 00:06:00for me. I was like, this is it. This is really—this is what I’ve come here to do. There’s nothing like realizing who you are and understanding, you know, I do have purpose, I do have something to offer, and realizing the legacy, the beautiful legacy of Black midwifery in the United States, ’cause Black midwives didn’t just catch Black babies. They catch white babies. They served everybody. And when you’re in birth, it doesn’t matter who it is, because it’s the beauty of birth.

Birth is a very humbling experience, to see the whole process of what a woman goes through. It’s really transformative for her to be pregnant for—they say nine months, but it’s really ten months. And to see just how she gives space to this other being, you know, nurturing this other being. And for this way this being just comes through her, and the baby being 00:07:00birthed, it’s just an amazing, amazing experience. And I think that’s something that we in the United States are so removed from, because we—I think it would be a much more humbling and peaceful country if we were more connected to birth, and just realizing it is a very humbling experience.

But, yes, it’s something I love to do. And I also learned that a midwife wasn’t just about catching babies; she was also about nurturing the mother, teaching the mother how to mother, and teaching her how to take care of herself, how to take care of the baby, how to— You know, as soon as the baby was born, you didn’t—the mother, she was treated like a queen. She didn’t get up doing things, because that really—you know, you have this muscle called the uterus, which is the size of your fist, 00:08:00and when you get to that point where you’re about to give birth, you know, your womb gets to the size of a watermelon, and nobody else has an organ that does all those miraculous things. And it takes 10 months to get to that point, and it takes about 10 months to 12 months just to get it back to where it needs to be, and they understood that. They knew that you have to rest.

And what they call the shutdown period or the quiet time, the first six weeks is very critical because that’s the time where she is literally open. You know, her whole body, her organs have shifted, everything is misaligned. And so what they do is they what they call binding. You know, you bind the body to help pull everything back together. Today, you know, they call it a girdle, but it was really more intricate because you actually use cloth and you actually wrap it around the midsection of the body, and you’re pulling in all the organs and to help also to pull 00:09:00the womb in, and keeping her warm because, you know, it’s a very important time that she doesn’t get cold.

And you’ll see that throughout all Eastern cultures that the mother stays in. She doesn’t wear her head, because you don’t want her to get cold. You don’t want her to get sick, so everything is kept warm, like, she’s going to get a bath— Back in the day, they didn’t give them baths because, you know, they didn’t wanna risk her getting sick, so she had to stay warm, feed her warm foods, nurturing foods, to aid in the healing process. So at that time, all the women and community looked after each other. They took care of the women who gave birth, and all her household duties were taken care of, because, you know, she wasn’t supposed to be moving around. That’s a time where she had to rest and heal and bond with her child 00:10:00and sit her in the bathtub. Well, I mean, bathtub—like, she would be in a bath of herbs to help heal what we call the perineum, the little space between the vagina and the rectum. You know, heal that and heal just the whole reproductive system, which you’re releasing a lot of fluids.

But it’s just a very precious time, because once the woman gives birth, then now it’s like you have to mother the mother, mother her so that she can mother the baby. And then today in the United States, slowly they’re realizing the importance of postpartum recovery, because postpartum depression is linked to the woman not being given any love or not being taken care of as soon as she goes home because, you know, all the focus is about the baby. And, you know, the baby is wonderful, but there’s no celebration of the mother, 00:11:00and giving her praise of her becoming a mother and being there to take care of her and to praise her. Because all of a sudden, it’s like she’s left to be alone and now it’s up to her to take care of herself and the baby. And that’s really not the way it’s supposed to happen, because it’s dangerous, because, you know, she’s gone through a lot. I mean, to me, the greatest marathon a woman can go through is to give birth. And then once she gives birth, now it’s the community’s turn and the midwife’s turn to take care of her, nurse her back to health.

And so slowly in different states they’re incorporating—what do you call it? They call it short-term disability or giving you more time to be home on paid leave. But in different countries, like Sweden, a mother is taken care of for two years 00:12:00by the government. You know, she has full access to postpartum recovery resources. She’s given what we call a doula. A doula is a servant; I think in Greek it means a woman servant. And she’s serving and nurturing the mother, taking care of all of her needs. And they respect a woman’s time and understanding the value and the importance of the woman being a mother and taking care and being there with the child, so it’s amazing.

It’s amazing to see what certain things are still lacking, but I have faith, you know, that it will get to that point where you will have—you’re starting to see in some of the states where you’re having paid leave of the mother and the father and whoever’s going to be the support will be given paid leave to be there and take care of her while she’s recovering. Because, you know, that’s where you can avoid 00:13:00so many unnecessary deaths, whether it’s infant mortality or maternal mortality, because at first she is very critical. A lot of women can go into deep depression. They can hurt themselves; they can hurt the baby if they’re not given sufficient care and time to recover. And I think it’s pretty criminal to expect a woman to go back to work so soon and to not respect the physiological changes that she’s gone through and giving her time to recover.

But, yes, just the whole process of midwifery is amazing because, you know, a midwife is not just there to catch a baby. She’s there to really, you know, teach the mother how to mother, teach the father how to father, and learning—she’s like that glue keeping the family together and incorporating communal standards, cultural 00:14:00standards. And she’s, you know, like the spiritual counselor. She’s the relationship counselor. She’s there to really, you know, watch the child as the child grows, but she’s really there with them, like, every step of the way, from birth to death. Even if someone, you know, is on their deathbed, she’s there to nurture them and to help usher them and have a peaceful death.

You know, there’s so many things that the midwife does. And she was a very vital character and role in the community, especially in the South. You know, it wasn’t just for Black families; and served [ph] for white families. And she really taught them how to keep it together and how to take care of themselves. She would even teach 00:15:00them how to work with earth, because that was a very important piece of her craft as her role in the community: teaching women how to be connected with the earth, be connected with the herbs, and using the herbs to not just take care of themselves but take care of the children, take care of their family. And they’d also use it as a way to teach them how to be, you know, entrepreneurs, teaching them how to take that and use that to also take care of themselves and have a business.

But back in those times, because of the economic conditions, there wasn’t a lot of money. But regardless, you know, midwifery work was always seen as God’s work, and that regardless of whether somebody had money or not, they were served. They were taken care of. The midwife came no matter where they were, and she would be paid, 00:16:00whether it’s with chickens, produce, promises. But, you know, it was always, whether you have money or not, I’m going to be here to make sure that you have a safe and humbling delivery.

And when regulations came in, well, back in the 1920s, when what we call the Sheppard-Towner Act of 1921, that’s when you started seeing a lot of changes with the government getting involved and trying to— I think that they honestly did wanna try to make some changes with the infant mortality and the maternal mortality, but it was more of an attack on the Black midwife. And at that time, you had a lot of doctors being created, and nurses, and so they really was replacing her. Even though they first get all the information they needed, but then she was really 00:17:00replaced systematically by white male doctors. And then it really changed the whole face of birth, having to not, you know, give birth at home but then you go to the hospital, and not really understanding the whole female body and the process, and being tied down. You know, women are supposed to be up squatting or allowing gravity to kick in when she’s giving birth, but when she’s in a hospital she’s forced to lay on her back. Imagine having to go to the bathroom and laying on your back. It works against nature, causing all different types of issues and problems.

But there is a resurgence, or definitely an awareness, of midwifery, I would say pretty much thanks to doulas, doula work. There’s a big movement of awareness of women, of their reproductive bodies and wanting to have 00:18:00a natural birth, wanting to have a birth plan and have a doula. And then in midst of all that, then there’s an increasing need for a midwife, ’cause if they wanna give a natural birth, first thing they wanna do is have it at home. And having it at home means having a midwife. So now there’s a lot more laws that are changing state by state to make sure that midwives are legal and that they can practice, and that they can practice and get paid to be there at the birth, even though you still have, you know, I would say underground lay midwives who are still practicing and trying to be there for women, especially in the rural areas where there are no hospitals, where they have no easy access to resources. Because women who are in rural areas, they’re in more danger than any—you know, I mean, you can be poor and be in the city, but then you have access to a lot of resources, but out in the country, you don’t really have much access to anything.

But, yeah, 00:19:00so I’m in school. I’m finishing up my prerequisites to go for my master’s in midwifery, and once I finish, open up a birthing center. And really, that will be my life’s work, developing the birthing center, and incorporating, I would say, the ancient African traditions of midwifery, and really trying to help, I would say, heal and educate, not just the African American community but also the communities within the United States, because there’s a great need for it. There’s a great need for the resurgence of midwifery to really eliminate a lot of unnecessary deaths that can be avoided. But I think with the continuous push 00:20:00of the reproductive rights community, slowly but surely they will definitely—I think birth will be put back into the hands of women, their families, and their midwives again.

RL: Your knowledge is remarkable. What did you know about midwifery before it was suggested that you would be a good midwife?

SR: I was always interested in women’s work. I mean, even before I was told that I would be an excellent midwife, I was always interested in women in particular, like doing—I always felt that I had a calling or a purpose to do healing work with women. I never knew what it was. I always said, “Okay, I’m gonna do something with women, some kind of women’s wellness center.” But then I always picked up all these different skills, ’cause I’ve always been very much personally 00:21:00attracted to health and wellness. But I always understood that it was a very special connection with the women.

Some people say cycle, some say period, you know, menstruation, but I always say moon cycle, because it’s really in the cycle of the moon. So when my moon cycle began, I started having these visions of my children. And then that really propelled me to be very mindful of what I did and how I took care of my body, the relationships I had. So that really was propelling me to really take a look at my womb. I mean, my grandmother, they didn’t have education about a lot of different things, but she knew enough to know that she couldn’t be the one to really know how to explain that 00:22:00new stage in life, so she gave me a book. She gave me—I guess it was like a health board, you know, the book where they talk about a woman’s anatomy and the changes that’s goin’ on. So I was grateful, because I said, “Oh, wow,” because I really did have a scientific mind and I just loved how it just explained everything.

And so I was just always fascinated with, you know, the changes a woman body goes through every month and understanding that a woman has all her eggs when she’s born as a baby. She’s born with all the eggs that she will have in her life to give birth, I mean, which was a lot. I think it’s over [video glitch; inaudible] eggs. So, no matter how many times you shed blood—and women are not taught—well, people, women and men—they’ll look at it as, you know, when the blood is being shed, that’s, I guess, a birth that did not come to pass, but that’s the body 00:23:00just constantly preparing itself for a baby, you know, the promise of it. And then the promise doesn’t happen, then, you know, the body just lets go of the blood, and then it gets prepared all over again.

But, yeah, I just find it fascinating, the miracle of the woman’s body, her anatomy, and being able to also transform herself once it receives a sperm, and all of a sudden you have this baby, this child that’s being created and everything. Even in the womb, as a child, they’ll say, like, be mindful of your thoughts, what you do, because the child hears everything. You talk to the child. It’s like you’re nurturing the child the whole time while the child’s in the womb. And then, you know, with tradition and with midwifery, you tell the woman to never go to a funeral, never be around death, because 00:24:00you’re carrying a life. And I’ve found, I’ve spoke to a lot of women where they would go to a funeral in their early stages of their pregnancy, and many times they would have a miscarriage. So, you know, it’s very important that whatever a woman’s doing, that she’s doing everything possible, and everybody who’s around her is to nurture and love and put that love out there, because the child receives all that.

But, yeah, I just find it so fascinating. And I think, also, with the men, too, men also have to be nurtured, ’cause they also make sure that the—and not just the females are taken care of, but they also make sure that the males are taken care of, they understood their role in the community, you know, as well, because men do have a very important role in the family, and being there, and providing support to the mother. Even though in tradition men are not allowed 00:25:00or be present in the birth because it’s seen as women’s work, and women are surrounded by women, but today, I mean, you have the male there, the father there, and many times that helps the mother to really have as much peace of mind for the father to be present. And then sometimes you have fathers who just don’t know, or I find fathers where they fainted or they just wasn’t prepared. Or then you have the fathers who are complete champions and they were there ready to catch the baby. So, you know, you never know what’s gonna happen.

But, yeah, it’s amazing. I think it’s such amazing work, and just honored to be a part of carrying on the legacy and the tradition of my ancestors. And actually, my father’s mother, she was a midwife, and she was a healer, educator. And so I feel like I’m carrying on tradition, I guess, part lineage. And many times, they would say 00:26:00that it’s something that’s also hereditary, that it tends to run in the family. So it’s an honor.

RL: When you made the decision to pursue this path, what was the educational process for you?

SR: Oh, it was just learning everything, learning the reproductive system, learning how to help someone heal, because I find that when you’re having a child, you wanna make sure that you yourself, that you have it together, whether it’s healthy relationships, healthy finances. You know, looking at the whole picture, what I’ll call preconception planning and preparation. Because in African tradition, we call it the rites of passage. You know, you have a young girl who, 00:27:00once her cycle begins, you’re preparing her for womanhood, motherhood. And by the time they reach a certain age, they know how to take care of themselves. They know how to be a wife, how to be a mother. And, you know, it’s an amazing process. Same thing for a young boy. They go through the rites of passage. And sometimes you’ll see in films where they took them out to the woods and they came back as a man. But, you know, like, that rites of passage piece is very important, the preconception process for a mother and a father.

And I find that just studying that just to inform myself, especially just all the different things I have gone through, and still go through, but not as much, just preparing myself, you know, my own healing process, taking care 00:28:00of my body, getting my financial—you know, relationships. So, it’s just a whole preparation piece, ’cause the womb and the sperm, you know, it’s like your child is only as healthy as what you have to give them, so you make sure that the womb is healthy, that you’ve done your best to eat right and take care of yourself, nurture yourself, and healthy relationships, then you’re going to give birth to a healthy child.

And, to me, part of my birthing center is called—well, I call it more of, like, a cultural movement, because it’s a mindset; it’s a way of being. So I call it conscious birthing, helping a woman and the man to become conscious of who they are, being actively involved in their own healing, and having purpose. Because I find that when you have purpose in life, that you know who you are 00:29:00and that you know what is it your role is to play, you make wiser decisions. You make wise decisions for yourself. You choose healthy relationships. You know how to choose a healthy partner, not necessarily marriage but you choose someone, you know, that you can decide this is someone I want to have children with. Then that causes a paradigm shift in having a healthy baby, raising a baby, but consciously raising that child to live a better life or to do things better, like to be progressive and to have a healthy community, a healthy society. So, you know, it all starts back with the womb, with the mother and the decisions that she makes.

But, yeah, it’s a lot to learn, and I just find that it’s a never-ending learning process because there’s always so much to learn. And that’s what I’m going to talk about today 00:30:00in a presentation, about the amazing things that they did, and the symbols and the remedies. It’s amazing, ’cause once you go into that world, it’s like, wow, they knew all those things. And it’s like, wow, we have so much to learn and do. You realize that they really did—how they started training them as a young child. ’Cause when the child’s born, what they look for is what they call the veil. Like, if a child’s born and they’re born in the amniotic sac, they call it the veil, and they say that’s a child who’s born with gifts, with psychic abilities. And many times they also say that’s also the sign of a midwife. And I was honored because the first baby I caught was born in the veil, so it was quite an honor.

But, yes, I find that there’s so 00:31:00much to constantly keep learning, because there’s so much to know. It’s like you have to learn the whole lifespan from birth to death, and knowing how to develop and prepare a human being for life. And I think that’s something that people today will walk away understanding just how much a midwife did, and how much she is the glue of not only her community but of society.

RL: Were there specific women who mentored you as you began this journey and have been along it?

SR: I think I look at my great-grandmother, because she taught me the art of being a matriarch. But I just look at a lot of women who I learn, whether it’s Mama Nonkululeko in Harlem. But I just try to always seek out Black midwives wherever I can, or learn what I can, because 00:32:00there’s just so much to learn. But, yeah, I mean there’s just— I mean, there was no one specifically in my family. Like I said, the only one that learned it was my grandmother on my father’s side, but she passed away before I was even born. But whenever there’s anything involving a midwife, I try to pick up information by books. I’m always just constantly learning. Wherever there’s something about midwifery, I wanna be there. It’s just electric [ph] for me. The constant learning is ongoing.

And I think it’s just amazing, the work that they did, and how much is still yet to be learned and known about—I call it craft. It’s really an art for what they do. But, yeah, and teaching it, and passing on the tradition, which is very important, because I think 00:33:00it’s so important for there to be a midwife in every—you know, I think every community should have a midwife, because, to me, that would help resolve a lot of social ills, as well. But, yeah, I think that the youth have to be involved in the process, because they are the future. And I think it starts at an early age, because the amount of information that you have to learn and know is very deep.

But they actually would not start becoming a midwife until they’ve actually reached menopause, because by that time they know what it means to be a mother, ’cause you can’t teach a mother to be a mother if you haven’t had children and raised your own family. So in that tradition they actually did wait until after they had raised their own family. Because when you’re a midwife, you no longer belong to your family; you belong to the community, and it’s a full-time job. A birth can happen any time of the day. You can’t pin it. You can’t schedule it. 00:34:00That’s the difference at the hospital. You know, when they’re in the hospital, they rush, because they wanna try and get it done within a certain timeframe, but birth can come at anytime and anywhere. And so if you have young children, it’s very difficult because you have to be there, nurturing the mother, take care of the family, counseling them, prenatal care. It’s a very demanding job. 00:35:00So that’s why I can understand why they say it’s best to wait until after you had your children to start becoming a midwife, because once you become a midwife, you now belong to the community and you can’t really be there for your children or for your— I mean, you have to have a very understanding husband, too, because, he has to be understanding of what you do and respect it. Because some midwives end up just either having divorce or having issues with their children, because you really can’t have— I mean, you can have a family, but you really have to have a lotta, lotta support because it’s a very demanding job.

RL: How do women come to you now? And at what point in their motherhood do they come to you, and—?

SR: Well, I talk to women at all different stages. My biggest focus is the preconception part, because, to me, once you become pregnant, it’s too late, ’cause what you’re doing— I mean, you can’t really change all the things that you have and have not done. But if you prepare your body, and you prepare your mind, your heart for whenever that time may come, then you’re better for it. I try to tell them what they can do every day to take care of themselves. Because you wanna avoid—the biggest thing among women issues can be preeclampsia, gestational diabetes, because the body takes everything it has to take care of that baby. So whether it’s pulling magnesium or calcium 00:36:00from your bones, because the body biologically treats the baby as number one priority.

So, you know, I try to tell ’em, “Make sure you take care of yourself because when you do become pregnant, there’s a lot—” I mean, there are still some things you can do, but many times, there’s certain—whether it’s if you have certain things that run in the family, you have to be aware of that, and also of your partner, because if you do prepare yourself and your partner, then you have better outcomes with the birth, having a full-term birth, and having, you know, a healthier baby.

RL: And do women come to you—they know of you in the community? How do they learn about you, and how do they—?

SR: Oh, the birthing community is actually very small. So I’m very much involved and known for my reproductive advocacy 00:37:00and my women’s work. I try to do as much work in the community as I can to educate. The biggest thing’s education, ’cause a lot of women and men don’t even understand their bodies or the whole process, and I try and do a lot of women’s wellness workshops, but I’m also trying to incorporate men wellness workshops, because the men are very much a part of the equation. You can’t just educate and be involved in the healing process with women and not include the men. And so I find that, you know, that’s also a very important part of the work.

RL: Are there young women that you are training now to be midwives?

SR: I would say probably so. I mean, there are young women that I— I was involved in doing a lot of training, ’cause 00:38:00that’s always been something that I’ve always been good at, which is I love to teach and educate. But, yeah, that’s something that I also want to incorporate in the birthing center, which is the apprenticeship piece, you know, the training piece. But I’m always educating. I mean, whether it’s something to talk about—I mean, I don’t care if I’m gonna train or—I’m always talking about something, whether it’s something they need to know, because I want them to make the connection, you know, about just how valuable they are, their bodies, and whenever that time may come, because you never know, I mean, unless you plan for it, but many births in the United States are not planned for. So I try to educate as much as I can. But I would say I am known in the birthing community, in New York and abroad, because the birthing community is actually a very small community. But I try to educate. Every 00:39:00opportunity I can to pass on the knowledge, you know, I take advantage of it.

RL: When it’s time for the baby to be born, do the women come to you? Do you go to their homes? What is that process?

SR: I’m open to wherever she is comfortable. What you do is—I mean, I’ll teach them, I’ll educate them about it. And the most important thing is women knowing their rights. They need to know what they have the right to know, and understanding their body and the whole process. And there are some women who are comfortable and have enough faith in themselves and the birthing process to wanna give birth at home. I’ve helped women give birth at home. I’ve helped women give birth at a birthing center, in a hospital. But I find that whatever you bring with you, I find that either it’s a doula or a midwife, is the one who sets the tone of that space, whether she’s at the hospital, the birthing center. But I try to make sure that I set 00:40:00the tone, so that way whoever is there, the doctors and nurses, to really respect this whole process.

And I always carry—to me, I always say my magic tool, my magic weapon is my massage oil, because the fragrance of it and the combination of the oils really sets the tone for the mother. Because I always massage the mother from head to toe to help her relax, because you can’t really give birth if you’re tense and you don’t feel comfortable, ’cause once she smells the scents, it puts her into a different frame of mind, and it helps her and the baby, and to just allow the body to just become relaxed and do what it do. But, yeah, I’m about helping the mother to understand what her rights are and what she’s comfortable with.

And sometimes, you know, you may not be able to give birth at home, even though you can have all the intentions, you prepared everything, but sometimes 00:41:00it doesn’t go as planned. But I’m always there, and always make sure the mother knows that regardless of how it goes, I’m here to support you. And know that whatever the decision is, it is your decision, that this is not my birth. I’m not in your body. I can tell you what to expect, but this is your birth and your body. And if you feel that you have to go—and if something gets to a certain point and you have to go to the hospital, then you have to go to the hospital. Don’t feel bad about it. You did your best. But, yeah, I’m about supporting them and whatever the decision is, and helping them to have as much of a healthy and safe birth as possible.

RL: Do you have children?

SR: Not yet.

RL: I assume that should that happen you would choose a midwife.

SR: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. I 00:42:00spend many times just thinking about how I would like it to go. I probably would—either I’d be outside in nature or I’d be at home. But, yeah, that, and also making sure that I would have a big support to take care of me when I’m home, because I wanna be able to relax and be taken care of when I’m at home. But, yeah, when that time comes, I will definitely be ready.

RL: What else do we need to know at this point about midwifery and the work that you do?

SR: To be very fierce advocates for the midwife. I mean, ’cause I’ve been following the news, especially in Mississippi. There’s been issues with— I mean, ’cause to me, regardless of whatever anybody feels, I think a woman has a right to—whether she wants to have a baby or not. I think she has a right to have an abortion if she wants to have an abortion. But 00:43:00I think just being very much involved in the whole reproductive process and the educational piece, ’cause I find that there’s not enough education on sexual health and wellness throughout the United States, but I think that’s very key.

And having that involved and be involved in changing the laws. I mean, slowly you’re seeing laws change when it comes to breastfeeding, things in the hospital, but being very much involved in changing the laws for making it possible for there to be more midwives and for it to be an easier process, because it’s not an easy process to become a midwife. And it’s done on purpose in the medical industry, because they see me as competition ’cause birth is a big moneymaking business. You know, if you convince a woman to go to the hospital and it becomes this domino effect—’cause many 00:44:00times, a woman doesn’t know when it’s time to go to the hospital, ’cause if you can still walk and talk, it’s too early. So if you get to the point where you go into the hospital too early, either they’ll tell you to go home, or they’ll have you check in and then they set you on a clock ’cause they start watching to see how long you’re gonna take. And then that’s when they start asking you if you wanna have, you know, an induction, or they’re gonna start saying that it’s taking too long and they put you on the monitor.

And so it can become a very stressful—you can plan for it as well as you like, but if you’re not prepared, if you haven’t done your homework and you don’t have any support to go in there with you—which is where a doula comes in, if you can’t have a midwife—then it can become a very ugly process where you could end up having an induction, which actually can take as long, and you’re exposing yourself to a lot of drugs, the baby to drugs. And if you plan to breastfeed 00:45:00once the baby comes, the baby is affected by the drugs and becomes, you know, drowsy, and the baby can’t breastfeed if they’re filled up with drugs.

But I try to encourage women to do as much as they can to know about their hospitals, about their county, and to know about what their rights are, and to really become very active in making sure that they get what they want. But it has to be a collective effort. I think eventually there will be—like I said before, that every state will have legislation on the table for midwives to practice wherever, whether it’s a birthing center or being a home birth midwife. But there has to be a lot 00:46:00of continuing advocacy for changing the laws and supporting family, prenatal care, midwifery, because it’s important. Really, it’s very important.

RL: This has been wonderful. Thank you very much.

SR: You’re welcome. [END OF INTERVIEW]