Ashelee Singleton

MATTIE STEVENS: This is Mattie Stevens, and I’m the interviewer for the Midwife Project, Scott Ford Project. I will be interviewing Ms. Ashelee—and Ashelee, give us your last name.

ASHELEE SINGLETON: Singleton. Ashelee Singleton.

MS: Singleton.

AS: Mm-hmm [affirmative].

MS: Okay. And we are in Bay St. Louis, Mississippi, at her home. Okay, and I’m gonna let her tell you a little bit more about her living in this area, and how long, later, but today is March 25, 2018. Hi, Ashelee.

AS: Hello. [Laughter.] MS: Okay. All right, I just wanna get to know you.

AS: Okay. My name, like she said, is Ashelee Singleton. Did you want me to spell it out?

MS: Yeah. Yeah, go ahead and spell it.

AS: A-S-H-E-L-E-E, Singleton, S-I-N-G-L-E-T-O-N.

MS: Okay.

AS: I 00:01:00currently live in Bay St. Louis, Mississippi—I’ll be 30 a little later this year—but I’m originally from Madison, Mississippi. That’s where I grew up. I went to school at Madison Central, and then I ended up moving my junior year to St. Louis, Missouri, and graduated from Pattonville High School in Maryland Heights, Missouri. After that, I went to college at USM, University of Southern Mississippi. That’s where I met my husband, and— MS: You can give us his name, too, if you— AS: Yeah, Marcus Singleton. He’s actually from Bay St. Louis; that’s what brought me here. But after college, we moved to Los Angeles, California, and we lived there for maybe about a year, little over a year, before we ended up comin’ back to Bay St. Louis, and we’ve been living here ever since. We got married in 2014, and since then, since we moved back, 00:02:00I’ve worked in sales a little bit, and just recently, within the last three years, started teaching. So I’m a fourth grade teacher right now. I teach reading and English language arts to fourth graders, which I really enjoy. Just recently I got accepted to Tulane Law School, so this next year I’ll be goin’ to law school, so— MS: Beautiful.

AS: Yeah, really excited about that, and, yeah, just excited about that opportunity. So my son currently is five months old, and we did use a midwife, which we really enjoyed the experience. When we found out that we were pregnant, we didn’t find out the sex or the gender of the baby, so we found out that he was a boy when we had him. And we talked about using a midwife. My sister—well, I guess I should say that, too. 00:03:00I have three sisters: my older sister is two years older than me, and she currently lives with her husband in China, and she has two sons—I have two nephews—and then I have two younger sisters. One of my sisters is 20, and the other one, I think, is 12. Eleven or 12, sorry. So my older sister, she, of course, had children before me, so she was very, very vocal, which she always is, about, you know, using midwives, and, you know, the natural type of thing, using as many natural things, and she talked to me a lot about cloth diapers, and, you know, just different things like that, ’cause that was kinda the route that she went. And so when we first found out she—and told her, she told us to watch The Business of Being Born, 00:04:00so that was, like, one of the first things that we did after we found out was watch that. And, I mean, it had a lot of good information, and really kinda made us think about how things are normally done, and what’s the norm, and maybe how the norm isn’t always just better, just because it’s the norm. So it really got us, you know, to start thinking outside of the box as far as what we wanted for our experience. So, yeah, we decided to get a midwife. For a good part of the pregnancy, I did have just a regular doctor, but I eventually—we eventually found the midwife we wanted, and decided to go with her.

MS: What is her name?

AS: Her name is Wendy Shaw.

MS: Okay, Wendy Sharp.

AS: Wendy Shaw.

MS: Shaw, Shaw.

AS: Uh-huh [affirmative], Shaw, mm-hmm [affirmative].

MS: Okay, okay. And she lived in this area?

AS: She did, and, actually, we had such a good experience after we delivered, we were, like, tellin’ her, you know, ravin’ to her about how 00:05:00great the experience was, and for all of our other children we want her to do it, for all of our children, and she goes, “Well, I was waitin’ to tell you but I’m movin’ to Alabama.” So I was like, oh, no! [Laughter.] So, yeah. [Clears throat.] Midwives are not very easy to find around here. I think she was the only one down here; I don’t know of any other midwives, so I don’t know what we will do for our next one, but— MS: Okay. I may be able to help you with that. [Laughs.] AS: Okay, good, good, good. [Laughs.] Yeah, I don’t know what else [ph].

MS: Yeah. You talked a little bit about your work, okay, and a little bit about school, okay. What about religion?

AS: My husband and his family are actually Catholic. I grew up Baptist, so I am currently, like, in between. Right now, I go to the Catholic church, St. Rose, right around the corner, and, 00:06:00you know, just in between right now, as far as am I gonna convert, you know, so that we can raise our child Catholic, so we’ll see.

MS: Okay, okay, yeah. As a matter of fact, I was tellin’ my sister that most people are Catholic on the Gulf Coast.

AS: Yes. Yeah, it was—I always laugh: I have a friend, one of my good friends from college, who is from here, as well. I tell her—it’s just the ignorance, I guess, because when I moved to Hattiesburg, she was, like, my first friend from this area, and I didn’t really know any Black people that were Catholic until I met her, and I was like, oh, okay! I mean, I guess just the culture, it’s not very prevalent in Madison, Mississippi. So that was definitely different. So it’s funny that I end up marrying someone who is Catholic, from the Coast, so—[Laughs.] MS: My brother, our own only brother, married into a Catholic family.

AS: Really? 00:07:00Really? Yeah.

MS: Yeah, they live in Pascagoula.

AS: Okay, okay.

MS: Okay. Have you ever heard of the midwife Stacy Rufkin [sic]? Stacy Rufkin?

AS: Stacy Rufkin—I don’t know.

MS: She lives in Alabama, but she serves the Mississippi Gulf Coast.

AS: Okay. Okay, so does she come out this way, or how’s that work?

MS: I will be interviewing her after you.

AS: Okay!

MS: I’ve gotta call her. She’s gonna call me and let me know where to come.

AS: Oh, wow, good. Yeah, we need to line somebody up just in case. It might be a few years, but yeah. [Laughs.] MS: Yeah, yeah. Okay. All right. So tell me about your experience with the midwife. What are some of the things you did all along the way, and after the birth, and—?

AS: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So our midwife is a nurse midwife, so the OB/GYN that I was originally going to, she was a part of that same practice. 00:08:00So the doctor that I was originally seeing, when I switched to the midwife I just went to the same place; it’s just I saw her instead of seeing him.

MS: Was that in Jackson or here?

AS: In Gulfport.

MS: Gulfport, okay.

AS: Uh-huh [affirmative], in Gulfport, yeah. So, yeah, I would meet with her, and we would talk, and she was just very open to us kinda, you know, goin’ the natural route as much as possible, and avoiding interventions as much as possible, and we seemed to be on the same page about pretty much everything.

MS: When you say “interventions”— AS: Like getting epidural, or, you know, anything like that.

MS: Any kind of pain, yeah.

AS: Yeah, pain medicine, inducing labor, and stuff like that. I specifically wasn’t interested in any of that kinda stuff, if it could be avoided. So she seemed like she was on the same page with us, and communicated well with us, and when I went into the labor—I’ll 00:09:00kinda talk about that—like I said, I am a teacher, so towards the end of my pregnancy it was always the joke that, like, my water was gonna break at school in front of the kids, so it was like, I was slightly nervous about that, that I would, like, get to fussin’ or somethin’ and then my water would just break and I would be so embarrassed, which kinda happened and kinda didn’t. So the day my water broke, I was at school, and I actually stepped outside of the classroom, lookin’ into the classroom, of course, but in the hallway, to talk with my partner teacher. I teach reading and language, and my partner teaches math and science and social studies. So I stepped outside the classroom to talk to her for a second, or asked her somethin’, and I went to the restroom, and when I came back I said, “I don’t know if my water broke. I don’t think so.” 00:10:00And she goes, “Well, what was it like?” And I was like, “Well, it was kinda clear, and it wasn’t a lot, though. When your water broke, was it a lot?” And she was like, “Well—” And then I stopped to say somethin’ to the kids, and then I was like, oh, no, and it just—and my water, from there, that’s when it broke. I ran to the bathroom, and we actually have a nurse on campus, so they called the nurse, and she came to, you know, the bathroom where I was, and had a wheelchair for me, and wheeled me on out there, so—and all the teachers were comin’ in, “Oh my gosh, you’re havin’ your baby!” So it was pretty exciting, pretty fun experience at the end of the day.

MS: But the kids didn’t get a chance to see your water break, right?

AS: The kids didn’t see it, yeah, [laughter] so that’s why I said it’s kinda both: it happened at school, but it wasn’t embarrassing like I thought it would be, or was hoping for. But yeah, my partner teacher told them, of course, ‘cause they were, “Where did Ms. Singleton go?” And they go, “Well, she’s 00:11:00about to have her baby,” and they’re cheerin’, so excited, she tells me. But so yes, so this was probably around, like, twelve or one or somethin’ like that when that happened, and—well, okay, let me back up just a little bit, too. The weekend before I had my son was Homecoming at USM, and I am a member of Delta Sigma Theta Sorority, Inc., and I cross at USM. And so this was our big ten-year, like, our big ten-year celebration. All of my sisters were coming, pretty much. It’s a lot of us, but a lot of us were there. And so I really wanted to go. So I talked to the midwife before, you know, all this happened, and I said, “Can I go?” And she was like, “Oh, yeah.” She was like, “It’ll be fine,” you know. “Just go, have a good time,” 00:12:00you know. And so I went, and, I mean, it was a lot of walking, and I was, like, super pregnant, [laughs] so—it was a lot of walking, and hanging out, but I hung in there. We had a good time. And I had been telling my baby, I was like, “If you could just make it past Homecoming, just let me go to Homecoming,” and so my baby was very patient and very obedient, [laughter] and he, you know, followed directions and waited. So— MS: That’s beautiful.

AS: —that was that weekend that I went to Homecoming, so that next Wednesday is when my water broke, during school, so— MS: Beautiful.

AS: So, yeah. So I called my midwife after, and we had just asked her that weekend before, like—well, my husband actually asked, ’cause he was the one that was [inaudible]— MS: And this is Ms. Shaw, right?

AS: Yes, Ms. Shaw. Asker her, like, “So when it happens, what do we do? Like, do we go to the hospital right away? Do we, like—?” And she was just 00:13:00really relaxed, which I liked. We both loved that about her. Like, after we would come up with all these questions to ask her, Ms. Shaw, when we would talk with her, I mean, it was like she was able to answer it, and we were kinda just put at ease. Like, okay, well, now we have a plan. So she told us, you know, when my water breaks to just call her, and we would see how things were going, you know, ’cause it could be that sometimes people have contractions first, that she was explaining to us, sometimes people have contractions first and then their water breaks, and sometimes their water breaks and then they have contractions, so just kinda play it by ear. So after my water broke we called her, and I was fine. Like, I wasn’t having contractions or anything, so she was like, “Well, yeah, if you want, if you guys feel more comfortable, you can go home,” and that’s what I wanted to do: I wanted to just stay at home and kinda relax, 00:14:00and, you know, wait. So that’s what we did.

So we came home, and, like I said, this was around, like, one or so when my water broke. So we came home and we stayed, and I didn’t really start having contractions. I was cleanin’, and packin’, and walkin’ around. And so it just got later and later. It was, like, five o’clock, and then six o’clock. And so we called her, and she was like, “Well, if you don’t start, like, really having contractions by, like, eight, then y’all probably just need to go ahead and head to the hospital. Let’s just make sure, keep an eye on everything.” So that’s what we did. Around eight o’clock, I was still fine, I mean, for the most part. I mean, I felt a little bit, but nothin’ big. So we went ahead and headed there.

Another funny part of it all is when my water broke, I called, you know, my family, let everybody know what’s goin’ on, 00:15:00and I called my grandma, and—well, I don’t know if—was it text, or—? I can’t remember. Anyway. But some kinda way, somebody reached out to my grandma, let her know, and next thing—so I go, “Well, we’ll just let you know what’s goin’ on. We’ll update you. I’m not having contractions,” you know. And she calls me again and she’s like, “Okay, we’re in Hattiesburg.” And I’m like, “Hattiesburg?” [Laughter.] So she was already on her way, okay. Like, there was no stoppin’ her from coming. Her, my granddaddy, they were in the car. They were already here before I even knew they were coming. So the funny part I always tell people is my grandma and granddaddy made it to the hospital before we did. [Laughter.] They were there waiting by the time we got there. So we got there around eight or nine, or somewhere around there, and got checked in and everything, and I was still fine.

MS: What hospital did you use?

AS: Gulfport—Garden Park— MS: 00:16:00In Gulfport?

AS: In Gulfport, yes. Garden Park in Gulfport, Medical Center. And so, yeah, we were just kinda hangin’ out, and at this point Wendy was just—the midwife—she was just like, “Well, just let me know. I let ’em know that you’re comin’, and, you know, just let me know how things are goin’. They’ll be updating me and stuff, too, so—” They came in. They checked me. At this point I was, like, three centimeters dilated, and I was fine. So I’m a first-time mom; I had watched a lot of, like, YouTube videos and stuff, and I was like, oh, [laughter] this is three centimeters? I might do pretty good! So I was kinda excited, ’cause I was like, okay, I can make this; maybe I can do it.

So, yeah, from there, it was getting kinda late, so my grandparents left, and my husband and I were just there, and we were just hangin’ out, and then 00:17:00I would say probably around eleven things started getting pretty real, where it was—[Laughter.] Yeah. I was like, okay, this kinda hurts. So yeah, we just labored through, and I wasn’t—like I said, I watched a lot of videos, and read a lot of blogs, and different things, and, you know, people, like, screamin’, and you always just see stuff on TV where people are like, “Ahh!”, and all that. And, I don’t know, that just wasn’t me. Like, I was just focused, like, laser-focused, and just breathing, a lot of breathing, and stuff like that. And so we made it through.

When I got to maybe around eight centimeters, that’s when Wendy, the midwife, came, and she stayed from eight to ten, and then till when we, of course, pushin’ and all that. And she just kinda let me do my thing, and I appreciated that. 00:18:00Like, she let me do my thing. It wasn’t, like, “You have to sit like this; you have to lay like this; okay, it’s time to push; lay down,” or anything like that. She just let me go, you know, and just encouraged me, and it was just a really, really good experience. It really was. She was— MS: And your husband was through it all.

AS: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

MS: [Laughs.] He said he’s a poster boy for— AS: He was definitely, you know, supportive, and, like I said, it was tough for him, and I, too, but it was tough for him, too, because we hadn’t gotten any sleep. Like, the last time we slept was the night before, and so then my water broke, like I said, around, like, one or two that day, twelve, or somewhere around there, and I didn’t have any contractions, really, and we were kinda just hangin’ out all the way up until that night, so then we didn’t sleep 00:19:00any of that night. He was born at 7:50 the next morning.

MS: How ’bout that?

AS: So, I mean, we didn’t get any sleep. So I felt bad for him, ’cause, I mean, he had to be a trooper to try to stay awake, ’cause I know he was sleepy, and I always would say, like, “I would be asleep, too, if I wasn’t havin’ contractions. [Laughter.] I would be asleep, as well.” But I was goin’ through some things, so—but yeah, so we—my husband laughs, too; he says, “You know, she would tell you that, like, you were almost there and stuff, and you weren’t almost there. [Laughter.] She was just encouragin’ you, I think, because it wasn’t,” you know—and he’s pretty funny, too. His experience, too, was pretty funny, ’cause he just talks about— MS: Tell me a little about it— AS: Oh, yeah, about him?

MS: —he and his experience.

AS: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. He’s such a funny guy. But he talks about the experience of, like, bein’ able to see it, you know, from the very beginning. 00:20:00He was like, “I could just see from when I could just barely see, like, a nickel size of his hair to his whole head, you know, comin’ out and stuff.” And he always talks about how it was so shocking to him that when Marcus, Jr., my son’s head came out, that he didn’t cry. And he says, “It was so weird,” he was like, “because his head was out. The rest of his body was still in.” He was like, “I don’t know, I just expected that he would be crying as soon as he came out.” And he was like, “But no, he didn’t start cryin’ until all of him came out, and then once his whole body came out, then he started to cry.” So he always talks—he was like, “That was just so interesting to see, just the little head just sittin’ there, and not cryin’ or anything,” so— MS: He was probably a little skittish, you know, as to whether he was— AS: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

MS: —awake, 00:21:00or actually— AS: Oh, yeah, the nurses talked about that, too. They would come in and they would go, “The look on your husband’s face [laughter] when all this was happening—” So, yeah, ’cause I don’t know what he was lookin’ like. I was, like, laser-focused. Yeah.

MS: He was concerned, probably, even if he was alive, you know?

AS: Yeah, I mean— MS: ’Cause they used to have to spank ’em.

AS: Uh-huh, uh-huh [affirmative]. And I think, at this point, I think that attests to the type of midwife that Wendy was, because I don’t think he was that concerned. I think he felt pretty confident in what Wendy was—you know, how she was kinda doin’ things, you know? I think he felt pretty confident that if there was a problem, she would know, you know? And she was so cool and collected about the whole situation, that I think he just expected that as soon as he saw his head that he would start cryin’, but he didn’t realize that, no, 00:22:00he waited. I don’t know, anyway, so that was interesting.

MS: Cool baby. [Laughs.] AS: Yeah, yeah, he waited. So at that point, when he came out, that’s when we found out he was a boy, and, actually, his name was Marlee throughout pretty much my entire pregnancy. We didn’t identify the gender, and so our child’s name was gonna be Marlee, either way, whether it was a girl or a boy, ’cause my name is Ashelee and his name is Marcus, so we were gonna do a Marlee. But we had a deal, probably around six or seven months. We decided that—my husband’s birthday is October 17th, so we decided that if the baby was born on his birthday, and was a boy, that it would be Marcus, Jr., 00:23:00after him. But we laughed ’cause we’re like, there is no way he’s gon be born on your birthday. Like, it’s not gon happen. And be a boy? That’s not gonna happen. So, like I said, the 17th passed, and it went by, and there was no, you know, contractions. Everything was fine. And then the 18th came, and then my water broke. And so pretty much what happened was when we were in the hospital he goes, “Well, it’s up to you. You know, we’re so close. You know, Marcus Jr. or Marlee, which one? I’ll let you decide.” And so I decided Marcus, Jr. And I figured that was so close. He was born on the 19th, so two days, and a boy, so, yeah. Oh, yeah, he had to be a Junior at that point.

MS: That’s all right. [Laughs.] AS: Yeah, so Marcus, Jr.

MS: Okay, that’s October— AS: —19th.

MS: —19th, okay. Very good, all right. So, now, Marcus lived here on the coast; he just went to school where? 00:24:00AS: Yes, at USM in Hattiesburg.

MS: Okay. Yeah, most family [ph]— AS: And what’s funnier is his parents met at USM, and my parents met at USM. [Laughter.] So, yeah, and now we met at USM. So now our son has to go to USM. His wife is at USM. [Laughter.] MS: Okay. Well, do you wanna tell me any funny stories about your parents, or about your family, siblings, anything?

AS: Huh, let me think, let me think, let me think.

MS: Any good stories?

AS: Mm— MS: We know your grandmother from back in the day— AS: Yeah, from church, yeah.

MS: —and we knew your great-grandmother— AS: Okay.

MS: —that used to live up in Flora. She was a— AS: Okay, Grandma Bea [sp?].

MS: Yeah, she was a very good friend of our mother’s.

AS: Oh, good, yeah.

MS: Uh-huh [affirmative], ’cause we used to live in Flora.

AS: Oh, yeah okay. Okay, I have a few friends from Flora, too, from high school. I can’t think of anything off the top of my head, but, yeah, my family was extremely excited. 00:25:00MS: And how many siblings are there?

AS: For me, I have three sisters, and Marcus, my husband, has two brothers. So he only has brother, and I only have sisters.

MS: You only have sisters.

AS: Yeah.

MS: Okay.

AS: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

MS: All right. Okay, very good.

AS: Yeah, I’m tryin’ to think of anything else. Oh, the experience afterwards was very good. She came and checked on us a few times, and I actually moved up my six-week appointment to, like, three or four weeks, just so I can meet with her one last time before she left. But, yeah, and the after process was cool. It was good, too. I was taken aback by, like, the breastfeeding thing. It was very—it wasn’t harder than labor—I won’t say that—but it was just so different. I guess because the other stuff I expected, 00:26:00when the breastfeeding part came and, like, all of a sudden now my breasts hurt and things like that, [laughter] it’s like, what is goin’ on? So that was, like—I didn’t really cry durin’ labor or any—but when I got home and my breasts were engorged, oh, I cried. I was like, this is unbearable. So, yeah. But I was able to breastfeed, and so I was able to deliver him, no epidural or anything.

Oh, another part about it that I really liked was—and I would do it goin’ forward—I would probably say, like, an hour after we had him, it was just us. Like, just— MS: Mm-hmm [affirmative], just the family.

AS: Yes, just— MS: New little family.

AS: Yes. Yes, it was just us, and I liked that. And we had delayed cord clamping, so they didn’t cut the cord for probably, like, I would say, like, 30 or 45 minutes or something.

MS: 00:27:00Is that right?

AS: Yeah, and— MS: Okay, that’s somethin’ new that I wasn’t aware of.

AS: Yeah, it’s like—it’s supposed to be benefits and stuff to it, and even, like, just bonding and stuff. Like, from the very beginning, I didn’t really want them to, like—after I had the baby for them to just, like, take him and do stuff to him. I just really didn’t want that. Like, I wanted to, after I had him, just to bond and, you know, us have our time first. And, I don’t know, I feel like that that helped with breastfeeding, ’cause he never had a problem. It could’ve just been that he was just good.

MS: He never bit ya. [Laughs.] AS: Yeah, yeah. Well, he is now, but—but yeah, I mean, he latched, and, you know, everything just fine, and, I don’t know, I feel like—I feel like those things helped. Like, you know, just the bonding and stuff that we were able to do right after having him, and, like, even to give him a bath and stuff, 00:28:00like, we delayed on all that stuff. Yeah. I mean, like, they wiped him down and stuff, you know, to get the majority of stuff off of him, but, like, washin’ him and stuff, I don’t think he got a bath until, like, the next day or somethin’ like that, so—so, yeah, we enjoyed, like, the whole process of it, everything about it, yeah.

MS: Okay. Now, Ms. Shaw, was she, you say, a midwife or nurse midwife?

AS: Nurse midwife.

MS: Midwife. Okay, very good, very good.

AS: Uh-huh, uh-huh [affirmative], yeah, she was a nurse midwife. So, yeah, I’m hoping for our next, when we can— MS: Do the same.

AS: Do the same, yeah. I know people say every pregnancy was different, but I truly did have, like, a, I feel like, just such a blessed pregnancy. Like, it was just not much sickness, and, you know— MS: Do you still have contacts with Ms. Shaw?

AS: Not often. You know what? I just started thinkin’ about her recently, ’cause he’s about to be six months, and it made me think about the fact that I wanted 00:29:00to invite her to his first birthday party, so—but I hadn’t really talked to her, no, since then.

MS: Okay, but you do have, like, a telephone number?

AS: Yeah, and that’s what I liked about her, too. Like, she gave us her cellphone number, so when I went into labor and all that kinda stuff, we just text her and, you know, was able to just call her personally to kinda contact her about what was goin’ on and stuff.

MS: Okay.

AS: So I enjoyed that part. So, yeah, I do still have her phone number.

MS: Okay, you mind givin’ it to me?

AS: It’s in my phone.

MS: I’d like to look her up. [Laughs.] AS: Yeah, uh-huh [affirmative].

MS: We’re looking at all the midwives that worked in Mississippi. We’re tryin’ to spot ’em and see what their experience was here. And we see that they’ve got a Friends website, Friends of Midwives website.

AS: Oh, okay. I didn’t know about that.

MS: Yeah. That’s how I went on and found Ms. Bufkin, Stacy Bufkin.

AS: Oh, okay.

MS: Uh-huh [affirmative]. And I had interviewed another one, 00:30:00Ms. Thigpen, is a member of that organization.

AS: Where is she located?

MS: Thigpen was doin’ Central Mississippi, around Jackson and the surrounding counties. So there’s one major one in North Mississippi, in the Third District, and then in the Central District, then, District Two, and on the coast. So they cover the area, and they’re keepin’ the midwifery program going. It’s alive, midwives program.

AS: Good, good. I mean, personally, I think that a lot of people aren’t very educated on it, and I think that if people—not sayin’ that it works for everybody, but if people would take the time to, like, really research it, and really kinda get more information on it, they may decide not to, but I think a lot of people would decide to, you know, go that route. 00:31:00But I think that it’s just been such a stigma placed on it, like, to feel like, you know, just because people are doctors that they’re better than midwives, or nurse midwives, you know. So, I mean, I think that about a lot of different things, you know, a lot of different interventions and different things. I mean, [clears throat] if people researched it, I think more people would be, you know, open to doin’ those things. And at least if they weren’t open to doin’ those things, they wouldn’t have the stigma that they have now, you know? Even, like I said, that we cloth diaper. It’s such a stigma with that, too. Like, people feel like it’s so much work, or that it’s just, you know, so different and strange, but I think if people just really looked into what 00:32:00it would take to do it, and what— MS: So you’re still using your cloth diapers?

AS: Yes. Uh-huh [affirmative], yeah.

MS: Okay, okay. And how long do you plan to—?

AS: Til he’s outta diapers. [Laughter.] MS: Okay, okay.

AS: ’Cause now, I mean, the way they make ’em, I mean, they go from, like, newborn to when they’re outta diapers, so—and then we’re able to just keep ’em for the next one, so—you know, I think that the experience, especially if you have a healthy pregnancy, that it definitely could be an option. I mean, we would be open to having at home, you know, have our next child at home, if it would be covered. But even that, even the fact that here that type of thing isn’t covered, and I think that has to do with that stigma 00:33:00that midwives don’t know, or that it would be dangerous, or things like that, but I don’t necessarily think that. I think, you know, if you have a healthy pregnancy, it’s somethin’ that you should kinda read up on.

MS: And it helps, too, to have a partner that loves the idea, as well.

AS: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, he was onboard. He was definitely onboard. I mean, he, actually, more so wanted to have our child here for the first one, more so than I did.

MS: Okay. Tell me about his family.

AS: I just—oh, yeah, his family is from Bay St. Louis. [Clears throat.] His dad is originally from Bay St. Louis. His mom is originally from Prentiss, Mississippi. Like I said, they met at USM, as well. And he comes from a big family, a big family around here, and just very supportive and—yeah, MS: Use midwives, too, or some of ’em.

AS: Yeah, yeah. Actually, where 00:34:00our house is, before we had a cousin, I believe—or he had a cousin, I believe—that lived on this same land, that came over and was, you know, tellin’ us about it, and we were—I don’t know how it came up; some kinda way. He was tellin’ us about midwives, and how they were used back then, and, you know, just different little stories about it. So, oh yeah, I mean, definitely come from times where people would use midwives, so—but yeah, things have just changed so much, that switch has happened where people feel like you have to have a doctor, or that things aren’t gonna be okay if you don’t have a doctor, and nobody else knows what to do, other than a doctor, which, you know—I mean, I hear anyway that the nurses do most of the work, even when you have a doctor, so [laughs] I definitely would trust the nurse, you know, to take care of me. 00:35:00I think the doctors just come when you push? I don’t know—I didn’t have a doctor—but that’s what I heard.

MS: Okay. So you didn’t even have a doctor to attend you at all, right?

AS: Mm-mm [negative]. No, yeah, it was just her. And, I mean, I don’t even think that really any other nurses or anything came in. They may have came in, like, when he was almost out, like, just as someone to hand her things and stuff like that, but the majority of the time it was just her and us.

MS: Okay, okay.

AS: Yeah, yeah, when she got there, which was good. Other than in the beginning, like, when I was, you know, early in labor. She wasn’t there yet, so some of the other nurses would just come in and check, see how dilated I was, and stuff like that. And they really just let me do my thing. Like, they just let me labor. They didn’t really bother me. Wasn’t a lot of them. I just kinda—just 00:36:00me and my husband, really, for the majority of the time, so— MS: That’s beautiful. Now, you mentioned the cost, and the insurance. Do you know how much it cost, or—?

AS: I don’t. I don’t. My insurance covered—I did some program through my insurance where it covered, like, pretty much everything. All I had to do was, like, do some little online classes, or, like, call—I have a phone call with a nurse, and it was like these different little checkpoints that I had to do. And after I completed that, then they would cover the majority of the pregnancy, the delivery and stuff. So, no, I don’t know how much it was, but they covered the midwife, too, so just like they would cover a doctor, they covered a midwife. They just wouldn’t cover her to do it at home. She doesn’t do ’em at home, but, yeah.

MS: Yeah, it was just the home—oh, yeah, I see. Okay.

AS: Yeah, so as long as we had it at the hospital, 00:37:00they were fine with it bein’ a midwife, which was good, so—yeah, it was a great experience.

MS: That is beautiful. Can you think of anything else that you wanna share? Anything.

AS: Um—not that I can think of.

MS: You think you wanna have some more, but not right now, right?

AS: I think I wanna—we, for sure—that’s what my father-in-law was sayin’ on his way out: like, one of eight, because my husband wants, like, six kids.

MS: Really? [Laughs.] AS: He’s always wanted a big family. He comes from a big family, so— MS: Must be eight of ’em, huh?

AS: Oh. Yeah, his dad has a lot of brothers and sisters. But yeah, so we plan to have more kids, but now that—I just found out, like, probably three or four days ago that I got into law school, so we gon wait. We gon wait a little while, so— MS: Beautiful. Beautiful.

AS: But, yeah, excited. Excited for the future and everything, and just watchin’ him grow, and it’s just been such an amazing 00:38:00experience, like, so surreal. After, you know, delivery and everything, it was just, like, such a surreal experience. Like, just can’t believe that happened. I can’t believe—[Laughter.] Like, seriously how I felt. Like, that actually happened. There’s a little baby here, like— MS: Makes it special for you and your partner.

AS: Oh my goodness. Oh my gosh. And, I mean, even now, when I look at him, how big he is, I’m like, man, at one point you were little and in my stomach! Like, and now you’re just—like, it just blows my mind.

MS: That’s beautiful.

AS: Yeah, how good God is, and how that all works and happens so perfectly. It has to happen perfectly to happen like that, you know? So for him to be able to grow and eat and—yeah. So it was an amazing experience. I really enjoyed it all, yeah.

MS: Beautiful.

AS: My husband, too.

MS: Yes, I can tell he was one happy camper. [Laughs.] AS: Oh, goodness. 00:39:00He thinks he has it all figured out. He is definitely one of those. Like, he feels like he has it all figured out, and he got it. [Laughs.] MS: That’s beautiful. That is beautiful. Well, I thank you so much for this interview. I have thoroughly enjoyed it.

AS: Thank you. Thank you.

MS: Okay. All right. [END OF INTERVIEW]